POL West Virginia May Invite Virginia Counties and Independent Cities to be Admitted to the State of West Virginia

SageRock

Veteran Member
H/T WRSA, AmericanPartisan.org

Edited to add: This Concurrent Resolution was introduced in the West Virginia House on January 14, 2020. It was then referred to the House Government Organization Committee. If successful there, next it would go to the House Rules Committee.

HCR 8 Text

HCR 8 History: Bill Status - Complete Resolution History

HOUSE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION 8

(By Delegates Howell, Summers, Shott, Householder, C. Martin, Hott, Graves, Cadle, Barnhart, J. Jeffries, Maynard, Phillips, Foster, Hamrick, Steele, D. Jeffries, Wilson, Waxman, Bartlett, Paynter and Linville)

[Introduced January 14, 2020]

Providing for an election to be had, pending approval of the General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Virginia, and a majority of qualified citizens voting upon the proposition prior to August 1, 2020, for the admission of certain counties and independent cities of the Commonwealth of Virginia to be admitted to the State of West Virginia as constituent counties, under the provisions of Article VI, Section 11 of the Constitution of West Virginia

Whereas, The Legislature of West Virginia finds that in 1863, due to longstanding perceived attitudes of neglect for the interests of the citizens of Western Virginia, and a studied failure to address the differences which had grown between the counties of Western Virginia and the government at Richmond, the Commonwealth of Virginia was irretrievably divided, and the new State of West Virginia was formed; and

Whereas, Such division occurred as the Trans-Allegheny portions of Virginia perceived that they suffered under an inequitable measure of taxation by which they bore a disproportionate share of the tax burden; and

Whereas, That this perception was further compounded by the effects of a scheme of representation by which Trans-Allegheny Virginia was not allowed to have its proper and equitable share of representation in the government at Richmond; and

Whereas, That this arrangement arguably resulted in the tax dollars of Trans-Allegheny Virginia being used to enrich the Tidewater through internal improvements which did not benefit the people of Western Virginia, while the people of the Trans-Allegheny had little to no say in how their tax dollars were allocated; and

Whereas, Though this course led to an irreconcilable division, and the subsequent formation of West Virginia, yet, the longstanding peaceful cooperation between this State and the Commonwealth of Virginia is a sign that such separation, undertaken even under the most challenging and onerous of circumstances, can, with the passage of time, yield lasting results which are beneficial to both sides; and

Whereas, In the intervening years, the same neglect for the interests of many of the remaining counties of the Commonwealth of Virginia has allegedly been evidenced by the government at Richmond; and

Whereas, Particularly, many citizens of the Southside, the Shenandoah Valley, Southwestern Virginia, and the Piedmont contend that an inequitable measure of taxation exists by which they bear a disproportionate share of the present tax burden of the Commonwealth; and

Whereas, The people of the Southside, the Shenandoah Valley, Southwestern Virginia, and the Piedmont also believe that, currently, a scheme of representation exists by which the citizens of Southside, the Shenandoah Valley, Southwestern Virginia, and the Piedmont do not have a proper share of representation in the government at Richmond; and, consequently

Whereas, The people of the Southside, the Shenandoah Valley, Southwestern Virginia, and the Piedmont believe that their tax dollars are used to enrich the Tidewater and Northern Virginia through internal improvements which do not benefit the people of these other parts of Virginia, while the people of these other parts of Virginia have little to no say in how their tax dollars are allocated; and

Whereas, In recent days, these tensions have been compounded by a perception of contempt on the part of the government at Richmond for the differences in certain fundamental political and societal principles which prevail between the varied counties and cities of that Commonwealth; and

Whereas, In the latest, and most evident, in this string of grievances, the government at Richmond now seeks to place intolerable restraints upon the rights guaranteed under the Second Amendment of the United States Constitution to the citizens of that Commonwealth; and

Whereas, The Legislative body of West Virginia believes that this latest action defies the wise counsel which has come down to us in the august words of our common Virginia Founders: as the government at Richmond now repudiates the counsel of that tribune of liberty, Patrick Henry-who stated to the Virginia Ratifying Convention in 1788 that “The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun”; and

Whereas, The government at Richmond now repudiates the counsel of a Signer of the Declaration and premier advocate of American independence, Richard Henry Lee-who stated in The Federal Farmer that “To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms”; and

Whereas, The government at Richmond now repudiates the counsel of that zealous guardian of our inherent rights, George Mason-who stated that “To disarm the people…s the most effectual way to enslave them”; and

Whereas, The government at Richmond now repudiates the counsel of the declaimer of our independence and theoretician of our freedoms, Thomas Jefferson-who stated in his first draft of the Virginia Constitution, that “No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms”; and

Whereas, The Boards of Supervisors of many Virginia counties and the Councils of many Virginia cities have recognized this dangerous departure from the doctrine of the Founders on the part of the government at Richmond; and

Whereas, These Boards of Supervisors and Councils have passed resolutions refusing to countenance what they affirm are unwarranted and unconstitutional measures by that government to infringe the firearm rights of Virginians; and

Whereas, The actions of the government at Richmond undertaken since the recent general election have, regrettably, resulted in unproductive contention and escalating a lamentable state of civic tension; and

Whereas, That, as has been proven in numerous instances, such as have been observed internationally in more recent times with the peaceful dissolutions of Czechoslovakia and the Soviet Union, and the creation of South Sudan, or, earlier in Virginia’s own history, with the formation of Kentucky, the peaceful partition of neighboring peoples can occur, and, is often very beneficial to both sides in reducing tensions and improving the tenor of discourse over ongoing political and societal differences; and

Whereas, Article VI, Section 11 of The Constitution of the State of West Virginia explicitly permits additional territory to be admitted into, and become part of this state, with the consent of the Legislature and of a majority of the qualified voters of the state; and

Whereas, In a spirit of conciliation, the Legislature of West Virginia hereby extends an invitation to our fellow Virginians who wish to do so, to join us in our noble experiment of 156 years of separation from the government at Richmond; and, we extend an invitation to any constituent county or city of the Commonwealth of Virginia to be admitted to the body politic of the State of West Virginia, under the conditions set forth in our state Constitution, specifically, with the consent of a majority of the voters of such county or city voting upon such proposition; and we hereby covenant that their many grievances shall be addressed, and, we further covenant with them that their firearms rights shall be protected to the fullest extent possible under our Federal and State Constitutions; and

Whereas, Providing that the General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Virginia shall give its assent to any county or independent city presently part of the Commonwealth of Virginia having the opportunity and ability to do so, therefore, be it

Resolved by the Legislature of West Virginia:

That the question of admission, or, the rejection of such admission, of any county or independent city of the Commonwealth of Virginia desiring admission to the State of West Virginia, and a majority of whose qualified voters, voting on the question, have approved such measure, prior to August 1, 2020, shall be submitted to the voters of the State of West Virginia at the next general election to be held in the year 2020.

Such proposal shall be placed upon the general election ballot in the following form: “Shall the following county (or independent city) _____________________(name), currently a constituent part of the Commonwealth of Virginia, be admitted to the State of West Virginia as a constituent county of the State of West Virginia.”

Should the General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Virginia give its assent to any county or independent city presently part of the Commonwealth of Virginia having the opportunity to do so, and such county or independent city desiring admission to the State of West Virginia, and a majority of whose qualified voters, voting on the question, not have approved such measure prior to August 1, 2020, but do approve such measure at a later date;

Then, this provision of this Act shall serve as an official request of the Legislature of West Virginia to the Governor of West Virginia to call a special session of this Legislature to provide for a special election to provide for the approval of the admission, or, the rejection of such admission, of such county or independent city; and, be it

Further Resolved, That the Legislature directs that the Clerk of the House forward copies of this resolution to the Board of Supervisors of each county in the Commonwealth of Virginia who have voted to become sanctuary counties for firearms rights, and to the Council of each independent city in the Commonwealth of Virginia who have voted to become sanctuary cities for firearms rights; and, be it

Further Resolved, That the Legislature directs that the Clerk of the House forward copies of this resolution to the Clerk of the House of Delegates and Clerk of the Senate of the General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Virginia and requests, in a spirit of peace and goodwill, that the General Assembly will allow this measure for the peaceful transfer of peoples and the restoration of harmony to the Virginias; and, further requests, in a continuance of such spirit, that any firearms legislation proposed by that body have an effective date far enough into the future so that this exchange of peoples and territory could be accomplished before the effective date of such legislation.
 
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MinnesotaSmith

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I first thought "hilarious" (in an approving way) when I read this.
Then, I thought "apt".
This followed by "astute".
Finally, I ended up judging it as "predictive", especially if the God-Emperor Trump is neutralized or removed from office.

Who would have thought CW2 would have started in Virginia? Yet, it may very well do so.
 

Sacajawea

Veteran Member
Yup; it's real. If you like reading whereas's... here's the text.


And while the first I heard of it, was because of Frederick County, Va never voting in the 1800s (and by default becoming part of Virginia instead) I decided to do a little ground work. And learned that this has been brought up in every beginning session (as told, since, 1780). This year's invitation is slightly different, because of the sanctuary counties.

Recurring themes in this story, are what is Constitutional? When do the rights of the people trump government? What is the limitation on government power and control? This issue has already hit the Supreme Court once, because after Congress ratified WV's sovereignty as a state (and after VA had also accepted it) Virginia changed it's mind and sued.

Details of that court case and the law involved here:

 

naegling62

Veteran Member
I had thought that states would succeed, but counties? I hope this works, if it does map makers are going to be busy.

We'll see if the Bolsheviks in Richmond will allow it without it getting physical.
 

CaryC

Veteran Member
Yup; it's real. If you like reading whereas's... here's the text.


And while the first I heard of it, was because of Frederick County, Va never voting in the 1800s (and by default becoming part of Virginia instead) I decided to do a little ground work. And learned that this has been brought up in every beginning session (as told, since, 1780). This year's invitation is slightly different, because of the sanctuary counties.

Recurring themes in this story, are what is Constitutional? When do the rights of the people trump government? What is the limitation on government power and control? This issue has already hit the Supreme Court once, because after Congress ratified WV's sovereignty as a state (and after VA had also accepted it) Virginia changed it's mind and sued.

Details of that court case and the law involved here:

Didn't click on the links and follow the whole story, so may have missed something.

However I would note that W. VA. became a state in 1861, not 1780. There's a lot of history there, and depending on which side you support, will decide whether it was a good thing or not.

Don't know if it is Constitutional or not, but would make for interesting consequences. States dividing along political lines, while still remaining in the nation.
 

Border Collie Dad

Contributing Member
I would think that, at least, two things would need to happen if this were to be done peacefully.
The Va government would have to approve it and then the whole state would have to vote to approve it.

Neither of those are likely
 

Blacknarwhal

Has No Life - Lives on TB
I would think that, at least, two things would need to happen if this were to be done peacefully.
The Va government would have to approve it and then the whole state would have to vote to approve it.

Neither of those are likely
I don't know; given that the counties have already voted to throw off one set of laws they may well vote to throw off another.

The power of government derives from the consent of the governed, after all, and if people so clearly withdraw consent, this could be an elemental switch.

The Supreme Court will likely get involved, though.
 

SageRock

Veteran Member
The West Virginia House Concurrent Resolution 8 references Article VI, Section 11 of the Constitution of West Virginia:

6-11. Additional territory may be admitted into state.
Additional territory may be admitted into, and become part of this state, with the consent of the Legislature and a majority of the qualified voters of the state, voting on the question. And in such case provision shall be made by law for the representation thereof in the Senate and House of Delegates, in conformity with the principles set forth in this constitution. And the number of members of which each house of the Legislature is to consist, shall thereafter be increased by the representation assigned to such additional territory.

For further information, here is the link to the Constitution of West Virginia:

West Virginia Constitution
 

Elza

Veteran Member
Didn't click on the links and follow the whole story, so may have missed something.

However I would note that W. VA. became a state in 1861, not 1780. There's a lot of history there, and depending on which side you support, will decide whether it was a good thing or not.

Don't know if it is Constitutional or not, but would make for interesting consequences. States dividing along political lines, while still remaining in the nation.
West Virginia admitted as the 35th State on June 20, 1863.
 

SageRock

Veteran Member
The Constitution of the United States, Article IV (States' Relations), Section 3:

"New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress."

If counties within Virginia voted to become part of West Virginia, this would not be forming a new State, but a transfer from one State to another, and so this provision might not apply. It would probably go to the Supreme Court if there were a dispute.
 

jed turtle

a brother in the Lord
What an awesome precedent that would be! I can easily foresee South Maine ( the coast, Democrat) and North Maine (Republican). However, I just don‘t see that happening, at least peacefully. The “Mason Dixon Line” runs down through the middle of too many dining room tables and bedrooms, much less entire communities...
 

Sacajawea

Veteran Member
Understood about the dates of when things happened. The 1780 date comes from the historical disaffection the original western counties (past the Shenandoah Valley) felt for how they were treated by the "elites" back east.
 

Blacknarwhal

Has No Life - Lives on TB
What an awesome precedent that would be! I can easily foresee South Maine ( the coast, Democrat) and North Maine (Republican). However, I just don‘t see that happening, at least peacefully. The “Mason Dixon Line” runs down through the middle of too many dining room tables and bedrooms, much less entire communities...
...how about NorCal and South Oregon folding into, say, Idaho? Or Nevada?
 

CaryC

Veteran Member
West Virginia admitted as the 35th State on June 20, 1863.
Ok getting hung up on technicalities. They separated in 1861, became a state in 1863, after going through the process of being accepted as a state, which is what most went through. You applied and then became accepted.
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
Just think joining West Virginia your county becomes part of a constitutional carry state, so you long longer have to get a license to conceal carry a pistol and should you get puled over law enforcement will not know if you have a sidearm on you and don't have to admit if you have a firearm on you if the cops should ask, you can legally say no even if you do have a firearm on you.
 

ShyGirl

Veteran Member
What an awesome precedent that would be! I can easily foresee South Maine ( the coast, Democrat) and North Maine (Republican). However, I just don‘t see that happening, at least peacefully. The “Mason Dixon Line” runs down through the middle of too many dining room tables and bedrooms, much less entire communities...
Actually the way the country is currently divided even between families this is pretty scary. Hopefully it will be scary to the idjets in Richmond enough to back off this crazy gun control crap.
 

homecanner1

Veteran Member
I find this fascinating. Not seceding from our union, nor asking to form a new state but rather redrawing the map outline of the states of Virginia and West Virginia with the consent of the governed. It has thrilling implications for the entire lower 48 with contiguous borders. What could a new map of the U.S. States look like if counties in Southern Illinois chose to join Indiana and Kentucky? If counties in the Florida Panhandle joined Alabama? Galena could end up in Iowa annexed by Dubuque for instance. Some sharp number crunchers need to compose a fantasy map for public scrutiny. It might be the divorce settlement we are all seeking.
 

ShyGirl

Veteran Member
I find this fascinating. Not seceding from our union, nor asking to form a new state but rather redrawing the map outline of the states of Virginia and West Virginia with the consent of the governed. It has thrilling implications for the entire lower 48 with contiguous borders. What could a new map of the U.S. States look like if counties in Southern Illinois chose to join Indiana and Kentucky? If counties in the Florida Panhandle joined Alabama? Galena could end up in Iowa annexed by Dubuque for instance. Some sharp number crunchers need to compose a fantasy map for public scrutiny. It might be the divorce settlement we are all seeking.
It would really screw up the House of Representatives and it would be a lot of fun to watch, but it might tip many people over the edge.
 

NoDandy

Veteran Member
I find this fascinating. Not seceding from our union, nor asking to form a new state but rather redrawing the map outline of the states of Virginia and West Virginia with the consent of the governed. It has thrilling implications for the entire lower 48 with contiguous borders. What could a new map of the U.S. States look like if counties in Southern Illinois chose to join Indiana and Kentucky? If counties in the Florida Panhandle joined Alabama? Galena could end up in Iowa annexed by Dubuque for instance. Some sharp number crunchers need to compose a fantasy map for public scrutiny. It might be the divorce settlement we are all seeking.
Yeah, put California about 100 miles off shore, but keep San Diego ( naval assets ), Edwards AFB, and the mint of San Fran.
 

homecanner1

Veteran Member
yup it would be like The Louisiana Purchase. Think really big remap. Maybe we have outgrown our old state boundaries and this could be a way to avoid bloodshed, a contentious but peaceable divorce and each county decide via referendum whether to remain or go in their respective states. I love the idea, it would be a 2nd American Republic without a shot being fired. Rather than form Jefferson or Lincoln "totally new states" or have a section secede and balkanize as "black or hispanic superstates' that would all be "extra constitutional", simply rebuild the lower 48 with more fair representation and statelines. Stunning move by West Virginia. And it already has a name folks, V irginia Exit = VEXIT. I am electrified by this!!!
 

Krayola

Senior Member
....a contentious but peaceable divorce and each county decide via referendum whether to remain or go in their respective states.
If liberals and conservatives part ways geographically, that would be wonderful at first, but just like they do now, liberals would destroy their own cities and counties with their stupid liberal policies (see Detroit) and then want to move into our counties to flee the mess and chaos they created and we'd be right back to where we are now. The only way to do this is to separate into two nations and seal the border. I am not advocating that we should do this, just stating how it is.
 

homecanner1

Veteran Member
agreed, but no annexation without state constitutional amendments preventing gun grab legislation. Federal Cannabis reform and salestaxes might even underwrite costs to merge. its a lesser form of balkanizing. I would anticipate western Maryland would want a similar plea deal with Baltimore, either let us walk away or another Antietam. Put teeth in it.
 

marsh

Has No Life - Lives on TB
In my experience with the State of Jefferson, it requires approval by the state legislature and Congress. (Almost all the counties passed resolutions already or it was on the ballot as a statement and approved by local people to form a new state of Jefferson. CA state won't approve it. There is no "popular sovereignty" right of the population to self reorganize recognized - see history, "state of Franklin.") Hey maybe N. CA could become part of West Virginia if there is some grandfathered thing-lol.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6x0460s0i4
Cripple Creek Band State of Jefferson song 4:44 min
 

marsh

Has No Life - Lives on TB
No CA fits better with Idaho. It is where most people are leaving for, or Montana. Oregon has been destroyed by Portland and Eugene. Jefferson could include the eastern part of Oregon. Many people in this region come from traditional, natural resource based, family operations dating back several generations, or those who have been raised in these communities. They aren't city people. "No Cal" describes them pretty well.

Remember, CA is a HUGE state and should be divided.

17342739_10212386049072945_7870762149402070083_n.jpg
 

AlfaMan

Veteran Member
I'd love to see a few counties in northern VA scecede to West Virginia. Richmond would lose their " pocket book". Because we send all the money to Richmond and NEVER see it being used in northern VA communities.

West Virginia would gain HUGE amounts of tax dollars from just one or two northern VA counties doing this.
 

Sacajawea

Veteran Member
AlfaMan, I'm not sure that's such a sweetener - given how much the demographic of those counties has changed due to economic refugees from the DC/NoVa area. That's why a lot of us Mountaineers, don't go over that mountain much, unless we HAVE to.
 

Vegas321

Live free and survive
Like have said. The US is going to break up, like the old Soviet union. States will band together, and for their own countries. Others will have counties fighting other counties in open warfare.
 

Vegas321

Live free and survive
Don't forget. Any fight for independence, will require " Red States" to fight "Blue States" for port access. All the libs live on the coast. And they could control all ports, and tax or cut off conservative areas.
 

Sid Vicious

Overclocker Extraordinair
If what I read last night is correct, several counties in VA never voted to join WV. Meaning the legislation is still sitting there waiting to be voted on 150 years later.

There is also absolutely no chance in HELL the communists will let any counties or state lines change. They wouldn't have a majority for 200 years, let alone a president (think electoral college).
 

MinnesotaSmith

Has No Life - Lives on TB
Don't forget. Any fight for independence, will require " Red States" to fight "Blue States" for port access. All the libs live on the coast. And they could control all ports, and tax or cut off conservative areas.
True, but I have the impression you're leaving out several things that when factored in make the outlook rather more favorable to our side:

1) The libtard coastal cities mostly don't produce much of value. The saying is that "the city needs the countryside more than the countryside needs the city". If (and low-violence isn't my expectation) the separation is relatively nonviolent, the rural areas would have plenty to bargain with.

2) Any plausible version of CW2 involves cutting off the highly vulnerable supply routes into the liberal cities. Any such place that undergoes a Siege of Leningrad (with no Lake Ladoga partial supply route) is going to have one massive dieoff.

3) Seemingly relatively minor, but not trivial in even a totally peaceful separation is just how much the coastal cities are subsidized by the interior (including noncoastal cities of size, which are much less likely to be libtard havens than coastal ones). Aside from food, fuel, taxes, etc., just consider how much flood and hurricane damage insurance subsidization the interior perpetually provides the coastal towns. Take that latter away, and you'd have pre-1960s Florida, where hardly anyone (relative to the population) of any means lived in permanent decent-value dwellings right on most of the coast.
 
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