LEGAL Illegal in LA to sell caskets unless you are a licensed funeral director.

Troke

On TB every waking moment
[scanned] WSJ 3/23-24/2013 pA11

The Fifth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on Wednesday struck down a Louisiana law that made it crime for the Benedictine monks of St. Joseph Abbey to sell their handmade caskets. The decision sets up what may become a historic confrontation at the U.S. Supreme Court over one of the most important unresolved questions in constitutional law. May state governments enact economic regulations simply to protect politically connected special interests from competition?

This story begins 1,600 years ago when Benedict of Nursia founded an order of monks and instructed them to put bread on their table through the labor of their own hands. Following this dictate, the entrepreneurial brothers of St. Joseph Abbey—a century-old monastery in Covington, La—opened a tiny business on All Souls’ Day in 2007 to sell the unadorned wooden caskets that they have made for generations.

That is when their ancient ways collided with modern America. The monks had not sold a single casket before the Louisiana State Board of Funeral Directors—acting on a complaint from a government-licensed funeral director— shut them down. In Louisiana, the government had made it a crime to sell caskets In the state without a license. To do so, the monks would have had to transform their monastery into a funeral home, including building an embalming room, and at least one of the monks would have had to leave the order to spend years becoming a licensed funeral director. All of that just, to sell a wooden box.

It didn’t take a divine revelation to recognize that funeral directors were using the law, the government licensing entity they controlled, and their political clout to monopolize the lucrative casket market. Lacking the worldly guile of their adversaries, the monks put their faith in democracy, petitioning state legislators in 2008 and 2010. Each time, the funeral-industry lobby mobilized to kill the monks’ common-sense reform proposals.

After that civics lesson, the monks turned to the federal courts to vindicate their right to earn an honest living. Louisiana sought to have the case thrown out on the grounds that Constitution does not forbid the state from picking winners and losers in business.

That may seem like a preposterous legal position, but in 2004 the 10th US Circuit Court of Appeals has upheld a similar Oklahoma law by observing that "dishing out special economic benefits to certain in-state industries remains the favored pastime of states and local governments." In ruling for the monks however, the Fifth Circuit held that the Constitution prohibits laws that amount to “naked transfers of wealth” to industry cartels. It is this disagreement among the federal courts that may propel the monks to the U.S. Supreme Court.

Though seemingly just a disagreement over the constitutionality of economic protectionism, the split between the federal courts also illustrates a clash over the role of judges. It presents a vivid illustration of why the decades-old debate over judicial activism is misguided.

In contemporary parlance, “judicial activism” is simply an all-purpose epithet that the right and left invoke to discredit a decision they don’t like politically. The throat of being denounced as activist has cowed many courts into “judicial abdication.” Louisiana felt it could argue with a straight face that government power may constitutionally be used for others’ raw private gain because the state was hoping for judicial abdication: a court so fearful of being called activist that it wili entertain even absurd justifications for a challenged law. Instead, what is needed in the courts today is judicial engagement, which the Fifth Circuit embodied in ruling for the monks. The court did begin by presuming that the restriction on casket sales was constitutional, and the court considered even hypothetical purposes for it

But once it was clear that the law lacked any plausible connection to a legitimate government purpose, the court enforced the monks’ right to earn an honest living by striking the law down.

The brothers of St. Joseph Abbey, clad in their plain monastic habits, never contemplated that nailing together pine boxes would begin a journey toward the Supreme Court. But they are prepared to walk that path if called to do so in order to secure the blessings of economic liberty for all Americans.

IIRC, some outfit that specializes in pro Bono for religious orders is handling this case for the monks.
 

Flippper

Time Traveler
Costco sells caskets and urns, they've gone up a lot in price but are still one third to one half of what you pay to a mortician. Local Indians sell pine boxes for around $100-win win there, guy gets to support his family, his casket saves money that would be taken from inheritances.

Cardboard box for me, I'll not care what I'm in, why put on the dog for a funeral?
 

ejagno

Veteran Member
As a Louisiana resident I don't understand what the big deal is when we can buy them at Sam's or Costco yet not from an individual. I went to the Canton flea market in October and they actually had a really nice one for sale for $100 because it was dented. LOL
 

shane

Has No Life - Lives on TB
My sister and BIL, for their son, my nephew, a couple years ago, got one of these shipped in...
http://www.trappistcaskets.com/

My folks, in their 80's, liked it so much, and idea of supporting the monks, I think they later pre-paid for a pair for themselves, too.

- Shane
 

TerryK

TB Fanatic
Costco special

funers-hero-130318-josephine-casket.jpg
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
As a Louisiana resident I don't understand what the big deal is when we can buy them at Sam's or Costco yet not from an individual. I went to the Canton flea market in October and they actually had a really nice one for sale for $100 because it was dented. LOL


I think it was just last year your state was trying to do the same and was defeated in court.
 
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It'sJustMe

Deceased
Costco special

funers-hero-130318-josephine-casket.jpg

Costco also has a lovely Mother's casket for just under $1,000. We purchased that one for my Mother and it was at the funeral home the next day. It is worth noting that they cannot sell in Louisiana, though.....here's the states that can use Costco:

Currently, caskets can only be purchased from and shipped to addresses in the following states:
Arizona, California, Colorado, Connecticut, District of Columbia, Florida, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Washington, West Virginia, Wisconsin and Wyoming.

Your bill to and ship to addresses must both be in the list of states above for your order to be valid
.

Here's the link to the Mother one:

http://www.costco.com/The-Mother-Casket-by-Universal-Standard-Shipping.product.11008302.html
 

Bolt

FJB
Costco sells caskets and urns, they've gone up a lot in price but are still one third to one half of what you pay to a mortician. Local Indians sell pine boxes for around $100-win win there, guy gets to support his family, his casket saves money that would be taken from inheritances.

Cardboard box for me, I'll not care what I'm in, why put on the dog for a funeral?

Cremate me and toss the ashes in the Pacific. No box, no nothing. I don't understand why people feel the need to spend a fortune on a funeral. (No offense to those who do, I just don't get it). I'd much prefer to leave the $ to family, charity, or pay someone's tuition.
 

Terriannie

Has No Life - Lives on TB
A friend of ours died of cancer and was buried 3 months ago in one of the Benedictine's coffins. He specifically requested it but his widow had heard our local mortuary refuses to bury those who want those coffins (instead of theirs) so she went through one in the town north of us to do the services. Later we found out our local one had already changed it's policy probably from local pressure I would guess. One doesn't mess around with monks especially ones that built the coffin that Pope John Paul II used!!!
 

Maryh

Veteran Member
My mother was buried in a casket from the Trappist monks in Iowa. It was black walnut and had the old fashioned shape. The price was around $2000. Our parish priest like it so much, said he wanted one. They are very plain and simple but beautifully handcrafted.
 

Publius

TB Fanatic
A friend of ours died of cancer and was buried 3 months ago in one of the Benedictine's coffins. He specifically requested it but his widow had heard our local mortuary refuses to bury those who want those coffins (instead of theirs) so she went through one in the town north of us to do the services. Later we found out our local one had already changed it's policy probably from local pressure I would guess. One doesn't mess around with monks especially ones that built the coffin that Pope John Paul II used!!!


These Monks were represented by a team of lawyers out of Virginia and the state was working with the owners of funeral homes to stop the monks from making Caskets and selling them to anyone that wanted one. The State lost the court battle over the right to make a living without undue government interference.

I guess someone could just twist the meaning as the law in LA says you cannot sell caskets unless you are a licensed funeral director and the people selling caskets to LA funeral homes are not LA licensed funeral director's.
 

Stormy

Veteran Member
I think this is a violation of the "Funeral Rule" law that was instated in the 1970's.

Any casket or coffin, or cremation for everyone should be allowed. That said, in cemeteries it is required for a full body burial to have a minimum of cement grave liner / box. Those actually have holes in them to let water in and out.

Much preferable is a vault made of cement, steel and lined with the same plastic that football helmets are made of, and the sealant is the same as is put on aircraft windows.

It will keep water, bugs and worms out until the Trumpet Sounds and Jesus says "Come Up Here!"

Just my knowledge from working in a funeral home for a few years....
 

nomifyle

TB Fanatic
Costco sells caskets and urns, they've gone up a lot in price but are still one third to one half of what you pay to a mortician. Local Indians sell pine boxes for around $100-win win there, guy gets to support his family, his casket saves money that would be taken from inheritances.

Cardboard box for me, I'll not care what I'm in, why put on the dog for a funeral?

I'm with you, I don't care either, just shove me into the creamatorium and spread my ashes in my yard, its my little piece of heave on earth. When I'm dead, my body is just a shell and I am no longer there, I've gone home.

Judy

PS back in January there were a couple of funerals of sick elderly gentlemen. I had the opportunity to speak to the grave digger of one, he dug the hole and delivered the vault. i asked him why the vault, and he said there were good in case the body had to be moved, it kept things altogether. What a rip off. My dad was very tight with his money but he had put money aside for his burial which include the finest coffin and vault. I just didn't get it. He picked himself with vodka but treasured his dead body. Go figure.
 

Troke

On TB every waking moment
Some states require vaults after embalming fluids started showing up in the local water supplies. Or so the claim was made.
 
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