CHAT Trump promises to indemnify all law enforcement (poll and discussion)
If he means providing each and every one their own malpractice insurance as part of their compensation package great.
Let the insurance industry weed out the bad apples since the "good ones" working around the "bad ones" have limited recourse in the real world.
As with most complex issues, the devil's in the details.
Let the insurance industry weed out the bad apples since the "good ones" working around the "bad ones" have limited recourse in the real world.
As with most complex issues, the devil's in the details.
mechanic 217
I was told there would be cookies!
For the good cops it is great for the bad cops it is even better,
I’m talking about Trumps promise to indemnify police, which if I understand correctly, the idea is to protect all law enforcement against personal civil liability, but not criminal liability.
1) Cop shoots someone, a “good shoot”
2) Court says cop was acting according to law, issues qualified immunity, cop is safe from criminal liability
3) Family of shot victim sues cop, cop faces civil liability lawsuit from family of shot person and faces great personal monitory loss, is tied up in court for years. Most cops carry personal insurance for this very reason, but they’re still tied up in court for years and not all expenses are covered by insurance.
To indemnify police, they would be protected from civil lawsuits as they are from criminal lawsuits when it is determined they were acting within the law
Now this is just my limited understanding, I’m no lawyer!
It’s my understanding that it was common practice for most cops (smart ones anyway) to carry personal liability insurance for this very reason, but..
it’s difficult to get now and has been greatly watered down, and expensive
Such is our current state of the court system
Southside
Has No Life - Lives on TB
Yes, this!
Squib
Veteran Member
I was a deputy and a Paramedic for about 15 years until the mid 90’s…
They were offering insurance like that then…most of us didn’t get it as the plaintiff usually goes after the big fish…the county, state, federal gov, hospital etc.
We were small fish with little assets, but…
Once we got the insurance, as some did…you were automatically a target also…after all, you‘ve got a half a million dollars in liability insurance they can come after now!
I’m not sure that the insurance companies are the best ones to “weed out” the bad ones, insurance is a risk based system and where police are needed the most just happens to have the greatest risk of personal litigation, therefore the hardest place to procure personal liability insurance.
This equates to police being “hands off” or risk adverse in certain areas.
This equates to police being “hands off” or risk adverse in certain areas.
A big pool would spread risk. It is a complex issue.
Why should areas known for good choices pay for liberal infested hellholes?
Gotta add: "they knew the job was dangerous when they took it".
eta: I suspect we'll all be disappointed when Trump clarifies what he wants to do.
Why should areas known for good choices pay for liberal infested hellholes?
Gotta add: "they knew the job was dangerous when they took it".
eta: I suspect we'll all be disappointed when Trump clarifies what he wants to do.
LightEcho
Has No Life - Lives on TB
If you are trying to stop unfair civil law suits, you are protecting a large number of abusive cops who need to be sued out of existence. Instead, go after the root cause of the problem: corrupt courts. Install GOOD supreme court justices and make it a hefty fine against lower courts when their cases are overturned by the supreme court. Lower courts will work hard to be right the first time.
Make it easy to punish frivolous law suits.
Make it unprofitable for criminal use of the court system and put stiff penalties on perjury.
When a defense lawyer coaches his client to lie under oath, slap him with conspiracy. A defense lawyer is there to see that his client gets a fair trial, not to conspire with him to lie & deceive the court to get away with the crime. A defense lawyer should be held to honorable standards. btw- same for prosecutors. When they lie, they should get the penalty they unlawfully tried to pin on the defendant.
When a judge takes bribes, let him serve the prison time of his last 20 cases.
Always go for the root cause- not the symptoms. Trump is screwing up again if he said this. Trump is lacking in wisdom and honor.
Make it easy to punish frivolous law suits.
Make it unprofitable for criminal use of the court system and put stiff penalties on perjury.
When a defense lawyer coaches his client to lie under oath, slap him with conspiracy. A defense lawyer is there to see that his client gets a fair trial, not to conspire with him to lie & deceive the court to get away with the crime. A defense lawyer should be held to honorable standards. btw- same for prosecutors. When they lie, they should get the penalty they unlawfully tried to pin on the defendant.
When a judge takes bribes, let him serve the prison time of his last 20 cases.
Always go for the root cause- not the symptoms. Trump is screwing up again if he said this. Trump is lacking in wisdom and honor.
pauldingbabe
The Great Cat
Will the cops still be investigating themselves?
I like it, but is it possible?
and who do you propose to use to investigate these courts and prosecutors? The FBI?
Countrymouse
Country exile in the city
If frivolous civil law suits against cops are not brought under control:
What will happen is the GOOD cops - who try to only do 'good shoots' if at all and who don't really want to EVER have to do that--will LEAVE THE FORCE as they won't be able to afford the insurance or take the chance of having some "he wuda ben a doktah" parents sue and take him for everything he owns because their darling little gangsta left him no choice but to shoot him--since he will be a responsible enough person to want to PROTECT his family/children from having their lives ruined if all they own is taken from them.
What will happen to the BAD cops--who are on a power trip--is they will just go on, situation normal, doing what they do--and YES will give the force even more of a black eye than it has now--
because this kind of cop will become the MAJORITY of what all cops on the force will be.
Which is what liberals WANT to happen.
That is essentially, a call for collapse. As I said I think personal liability insurance is going to be hard to get, or very expensive driving up cost of policing. I point to the medical establishment where tort, malpractice and other litigation costs have driven up the cost of healthcare and insurance rates for everyone. If police are forced to obtain insurance, that must be accounted for in wages as part of compensation (cost of doing business) which drives up the costs for everyone, even in counties, cities and states without massive recent litigation against police.
Here’s an article that shows the effects of George Floyd and on insurance rates that might interest you and others on here.
Police liability market still tough for buyers - Business Insurance
Two years after the murder of George Floyd by a police officer and the nationwide turmoil the killing sparked, the law enforcement liability insurance market, which was already hardening, remains challenged, and many experts say it is unlikely to dramatically change any time soon.
It’s an interesting idea to indemnify police, but scary too. I’ve said before years ago here somewhere that a return to law and order, a return to a republic, is going to be bloody and full of cracked eggs. I think Trump has recognized that.
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West
Senior
Muse...
Personal and businesses general liability raises yearly and in some trades or occupations is basically mandated to stay compliant in most states, cities, etc...
It keeps getting more expensive not because of inflation in general, but because the insurance companies often settle out of court, because it's cheaper. The lawyers on all sides laugh all the way to the bank and back. While governments enable the circus, and often mandate the insurances.
Frivolous lawsuits are not prevalent because there settled out of court. Just as bad.
It sounds as if you’re in favor of indemnifying the police?
Everything you say points to higher taxpayer costs re: policing
greysage
On The Level
Profit of Doom
Dismember
Did you spend any part of last night near a Holiday Inn?
West
Senior
Because the tax payers will have to pay the personal lawsuits on said police?
that, and frivolous lawsuits have the effect of good guys with guns not wanting to put on a badge
It used to be very rare that cops would face civil litigation due to qualified immunity (no standing to sue when there’s no criminal actions) or the department would step in and face the civil suit side shielding the individual cop
The weaponizing of our DOJ and weaponizing courts are having an effect on the personal risks of policing, especially so with racial issues
It’s like MGTOW, but with cops and it ain’t the power tripping shitbag corrupt cops that look for other employment
Border Collie Dad
Flat Earther
Reading this thread and started wondering.
What is the purpose of police?
Do they deter crime?
I guess they enforce the law but who's law?
Serve and protect?
Who?
What is the purpose of police?
Do they deter crime?
I guess they enforce the law but who's law?
Serve and protect?
Who?
West
Senior
Muse ....
Not serve and protect much anymore. More like fine and arrest, when the only victim is the lawbreakers.
But Not with illegal aliens and often the homeless Americans. They are not prosecuted for breaking the laws. Because only Americans with assets are prosecuted, 99.9999% of the time.
Profit of Doom
Dismember
Wanna abolish the IRS while you’re at it?