EBOLA What's happening with the airlines? Are travelers canceling their reservations?

minkykat

Komplainy Kat
My Mother-in-law and BIL were to have arrived tomorrow from CA for a week.
Hubby and I were so excited. I prepped all kinds of food, had a nice menu planned. Got time off work and was looking forward to their company.

Then that selfish cow took her flight.

They are not coming now.
Frontier will keep the tickets open but are taking out a cut for their "trouble" I suppose. MIL and BIL will have to pay the difference when they do come.

Thanks, cow.
 

willowlady

Veteran Member
The problem with the available statistics on flights vs. driving (yes, they absolutely show flying is safer) is the ebola monkey wrench in the number system. My DH and I have long standing plans to fly 600+ miles for Christmas. Not booked yet. Here's the conundrum: We will wait until the end of Oct or so to book, but it now appears we are in the early phases of a nationwide news blackout regarding any new and existing ebola cases. That leaves us unable to make a logical, sound decision about whether to fly, drive or stay home. It also leaves us, and the rest of the nation, in the position of having to rely on word-of-mouth (sometimes referred to as RUMOR) to try to asses an accurate picture of the odds of our catching and/or spreading the disease. As far as the relative risks of ebola, yes there are reportedly 36,000 flu deaths in the US yearly. But how many of those deaths happen because of a broken medical system (refusal to hospitalize until too late to do any good), already seriously compromised patients (HIV, extreme youth or age, other existing medical problems, which previously mentioned problem renders fatal, and other reasons I cannot think of off the top of my head? Long story short: We haven't decided yet. Amazingly, I contacted the family with which we'll be staying and advised them if it gets bad we won't be coming. Turns out they have been contemplating same issues and are completely understanding if we chose not to go. Certainly, some of the sheeple are awakening....
 

Betty_Rose

Veteran Member
My Mother-in-law and BIL were to have arrived tomorrow from CA for a week.
Hubby and I were so excited. I prepped all kinds of food, had a nice menu planned. Got time off work and was looking forward to their company.

Then that selfish cow took her flight.

They are not coming now.
Frontier will keep the tickets open but are taking out a cut for their "trouble" I suppose. MIL and BIL will have to pay the difference when they do come.

Thanks, cow.

I don't understand. Was it the airline that canceled, or your family members?

Just curious.

Thanks.
 

Betty_Rose

Veteran Member
As far as the relative risks of ebola, yes there are reportedly 36,000 flu deaths in the US yearly. But how many of those deaths happen because of a broken medical system (refusal to hospitalize until too late to do any good), already seriously compromised patients (HIV, extreme youth or age, other existing medical problems, which previously mentioned problem renders fatal, and other reasons I cannot think of off the top of my head?

For several years, my auntie was in the nursing home with Alzheimer's disease. Every year, there were many deaths from the flu (or resulting pnueumonia). Many of the elderly did not get a flu shot for many reasons, partly because, the family knew that letting these folks "leave this world" was a kinder fate than prolonging a life that had no meaning or purpose.

I wonder how many of those thousands of "flu victims" were like my auntie, where the flu becomes "the old man's friend"?
 

library lady

Veteran Member
Slightly off topic, but... I was on a flight out of Houston on Monday. After the beverage/meal service, I noticed the flight attendants collecting the cups, wrappers, etc., with their bare hands. They grabbed cups by their rims. I thought about the presence of saliva, etc. I almost said something to the attendant but she was already at the next row.

I think they should be allowed to handle things with gloves at the very least. Handling people's plates and cups is an easy way to spread germs of any kind at this time of year. And one sick flight attendant during the incubation period would fly with lots of people.
 

Capt. Eddie

Veteran Member
I'd love to hear if people are traveling with masks, goggles, gloves.

For those TB2Kers traveling - please let us know what you see at the airports and on planes.

Of course, I don't think the vast majority of the sheeple "get" how much seriously deep doo we are in at this point.

Didn't see one person with any type of PPE at any of the airports I was at or on any of my flights.
 

Warthog

Black Out
The service workers and flight attendants unions are both ready to walk out due to unsafe ebola conditions!
 

Trivium Pursuit

Has No Life - Lives on TB
The service workers and flight attendants unions are both ready to walk out due to unsafe ebola conditions!

COuld get stranded at my contracting site. Actually, I've wondered about the possibility of that happening more than once over the last 2 years...
 

The Traveler

Veteran Member
I flew Thursday from Salt Lake City to DFW then to Shreveport. Salt Lake was busy as hell. DFW seemed normal and so did Shreveport. I saw one oriental woman with a mask on but I think she was worried about SARS lol. Other than that I didn't see anything out of the ordinary. My wife flies to see me in a couple of weeks and then I fly home for Thanksgiving. At that time I will see where we are with the ROI and determine if I will drive home at Christmas or fly. I have time to decide and make an informed decision.

Good luck with all who travel in the near future no matter what means of travel you take. One other thing I don't believe anyone got sick from exposure to Patrick Sawyer or Duncan while they flew, so think about that while you are pondering your travel plans.
 

willowlady

Veteran Member
One other thing I don't believe anyone got sick from exposure to Patrick Sawyer or Duncan while they flew, so think about that while you are pondering your travel plans.

Very good point....
 

Capt. Eddie

Veteran Member
That is an excellent point. Makes me feel a little better about my situation. If I get stranded I can always drive home if I have to.
 

Mavelle

Contributing Member
I was just thinking about the flight attendants yesterday. My heart goes out to all of them and I'm sure they're pretty scared right now. Are any of them posting online about what's really going on? Also, has anyone heard anything from any passenger on that flight from Nigeria to JFK? I can't believe the guy died on the plane and none of the passengers are talking about it.
 

R.Tist

Membership Revoked
We're assuming an incubation period of 2-21 days, and at this juncture, I'm unsure it's safe to do that. It has only been 23 days since Mr.Duncan flew....

Not to alarm anyone, but it wouldn't hurt if we opted to exercise "an abundance of caution" ourselves, now would it?

Artie.
 

Countrymouse

Country exile in the city
Prices are way down if you're looking for a bargain, its only a matter of time until people start wearing masks, gloves and other protective gear onto planes.

When Dr. Gil Mobley tried that at Hartsfield (full Hazmat) they told him to take it off or he couldn't get on his flight.

They just 'might' do the same with you.
 

Sleeping Cobra

TB Fanatic
I flew Thursday from Salt Lake City to DFW then to Shreveport. Salt Lake was busy as hell. DFW seemed normal and so did Shreveport. I saw one oriental woman with a mask on but I think she was worried about SARS lol. Other than that I didn't see anything out of the ordinary. My wife flies to see me in a couple of weeks and then I fly home for Thanksgiving. At that time I will see where we are with the ROI and determine if I will drive home at Christmas or fly. I have time to decide and make an informed decision.

Good luck with all who travel in the near future no matter what means of travel you take. One other thing I don't believe anyone got sick from exposure to Patrick Sawyer or Duncan while they flew, so think about that while you are pondering your travel plans.

SkyWest / Delta Connection Has A Major Hub There. Stay safe flying and being with the crowds.
 

Betty_Rose

Veteran Member
The service workers and flight attendants unions are both ready to walk out due to unsafe ebola conditions!

I'm surprised we haven't heard about any airline attendants getting sick. If I were a flight attendant, I'd be nervous as a cat.

Can you provide a link on the service workers/flight attendant story?
 

R.Tist

Membership Revoked
Ebola diagnosis delayed after Air Canada refuses to transport blood sample.

Lab tests not completed for more than 24 hours after being collected in Edmonton

Marion Warnica, Caitlin Hanson CBC News

Posted:Oct 17, 2014 1:53 PM MT
Last Updated:Oct 17, 2014 9:00 PM MT

Medical testing of a blood sample from a patient with Ebola-like symptoms was delayed more than 24 hours after Air Canada originally refused to transport the material from Edmonton to a national laboratory in Winnipeg. Sean Gallup/Getty

CBC News is dedicating a special day of coverage to the Ebola crisis on Tuesday. On radio, television and online, we'll explore the facts behind Ebola and answer questions. Be part of the conversation Tuesday by using #ebolafacts on social media or by joining our live chat on CBCNews.ca starting at 8 p.m. ET.

Health officials say an Air Canada pilot refused to fly a blood specimen from a patient suspected of Ebola from Edmonton to Winnipeg last weekend.

The refusal was part of a delay that ultimately slowed the patient’s diagnosis by more than 24 hours.

Sources tell CBC News the patient in question came into the emergency room of an Edmonton-area hospital midday on October 11.

Approximate timeline for blood sample delivery
Midday Saturday: Patient arrived at original Edmonton Hospital

Early-evening Saturday: Patient transferred to University of Alberta Hospital, bloodwork collected

9:30-10:15 p.m. Saturday: Air Canada staff at Edmonton International Airport refuse blood sample

11 p.m. Saturday: Sample returned to University of Alberta Hospital

9:30-10 a.m. Sunday: Blood sample arrives at airport

5:10 p.m. Sunday: Blood sample placed on flight to Winnipeg

8 p.m. Sunday: Blood sample arrives in Winnipeg

12 a.m. Monday: Lab results rule out Ebola

Because the patient’s symptoms met the case definitions put forward by the province, the U.S. Center for Disease Control and the Public Health Agency of Canada, the patient was transferred to the University of Alberta Hospital – one of four treatment centres set up to deal with patients diagnosed with Ebola in Alberta.

At the second hospital, staff followed Ebola protocols, putting the patient into isolation and collecting a blood sample to be delivered to Winnipeg's National Microbiology Lab.

The Edmonton hospital then hired a courier to transport the blood sample to the Edmonton International Airport, where the sample was to be flown out on the next plane.

Because the call to transport the sample came in after hours, the lab was not able to use Purolator, its usual service – and instead called World Courier, which it had used successfully before.

But when World Courier arrived at the Edmonton International Airport around 10 p.m., sources say the sample was refused.

With no other options, the patient’s blood sample was then sent back to the lab at the University of Alberta Hospital for overnight storage, with a request that it be returned to the airport in the morning when more staff were on duty.

Hoping to avoid a repeat of the previous night, on Sunday morning World Courier called ahead to confirm airport staff would accept the sample.

At that time, the courier was told that Air Canada needed four hours' notice before the sample could be shipped out.

No one at the hospital was aware of the four-hour requirement, however, so the sample did not ship out in time to make the noon flight, said the source.

Instead, the sample was eventually booked on a 5 p.m. flight to Winnipeg, reaching the lab around 8 p.m.

It was not until midnight Sunday – nearly 36 hours after the patient first visited a hospital – that Ebola was ruled out.

Health Canada, Air Canada disagree on cause of delay:
"It is my understanding that the pilot who was going to fly the sample had some concerns ... and there was a delay in getting the sample on board and off to a lab," said Vickie Kaminski, president and CEO of Alberta Health Services.

"Yes, we have had a particular challenge in transporting a sample," confirmed Canada's Minister of Health Rona Ambrose.


Rona Ambrose
'In this particular instance, this was about misinformation and fear,' said Canada's Health Minister Rona Ambrose on Friday. (CBC)

"In this particular instance, this was about misinformation and fear,” she added.

Speaking with Ambrose, Canada's Chief Public Health Officer Dr. Gregory Taylor said individuals involved in transporting the test materials have no reason to fear for their safety.

"It is a sample in a container and another container so it is very, very safe and meets rigid standards for shipment to make sure if it's dropped it doesn't leak out," he said.

“Whenever a province wants to ship an Ebola sample, ERAP [emergency response assistance plan] is activated and we go through a process with Transport Canada with standards that we helped establish.”

Taylor said Ottawa has followed up with Air Canada about the issue, and that health officials and Transport Canada are working to make sure that there are no other problems when it comes to transporting blood.

Air Canada, however, told CBC News the sample arrived too late on Saturday to complete safety checks, and that it was not packaged correctly when it was brought in on Sunday.

“Air Canada routinely handles the shipment of diagnostic samples to laboratories for testing,” said the airline spokeswoman Angela Mah in an emailed statement on Friday afternoon.

"There are understandably very strict protocols for transporting these items, requiring more than 65 specific items that must be checked for compliance in order for us to accept these for safe carriage."

But AHS spokesman Kerry Williamson disputes Air Canada's claims the packaging was the problem.

"We are unaware of any issues with the packaging of that sample. We are confident the sample was packaged correctly," he said. "Packaging of such samples is performed by highly trained laboratory technicians, who ensure packaging requirements are met."

Delay highlights problem with system, say sources
This was not the first time the University of Alberta lab had sent an Ebola sample to Winnipeg for testing.

According to CBC's sources, samples in the past have been sent without needing four hours notice.

The significant and unexpected delay left both the patient and hospital staff feeling anxious and ill-prepared.

"It is frustrating to see a whole day’s delay, but we assume a patient is positive until proven otherwise, so all of the positive measures were put in the day before,” said one of the health-care workers involved in the patient’s care.

"We treat the patient as if they are positive, work to minimize anxiety and to minimize any risk of transmission."

Dr. Stan Houston, a professor of infectious disease and public health with the University of Alberta, was one of the doctors who treated the patient.

Houston said the complex protocols in place to screen for Ebola may have contributed to the delay in diagnosis.

"I circulated a timeline of just what happened from the time of the patient's presentation until their diagnosis and highlighted some concerns," he said.

Apart from the delay in determining test results, Houston said workers’ efforts to isolate and treat the patient were effective.

In particular, he commended the unit’s addition of a trained staff member dedicated to ensuring health-care workers follow safety protocols in changing in and out of protective equipment.

“It’s so complicated and doing it right is key – and we had support to do it right. That made me feel really comfortable and confident about being involved in the patient’s care safely.”

In the future, Houston said some of the delays seen in this case could be avoided by collecting a blood sample as soon as a patient arrives in hospital, rather than waiting for their transfer to one of Alberta’s main Ebola treatment centres.
Earlier this week, several health-care workers in the province complained about lack of training and protective equipment available to staff working with potential Ebola patients.

Province hopes to take over more local testing
Kaminski, of Alberta Health Services, said the incident has highlighted the importance of improving local blood testing.


Vicki Kaminski
'We can't afford delays,' said Vickie Kaminski, president of Alberta Health Services, on Friday. (CBC)

"We can't afford delays," she said.
"I understand public health concerns and safety concerns, but I also think that we need to be looking at how we can reassure people … How do we get information to them that makes them feel comfortable and understand that they are safe when we’re asking them to do these procedures?"

"Right now, given [that] Ebola testing is so specific, we’re looking at what we can do here," she said.While Kaminski said some local testing is available in the province, Alberta still relies heavily upon the main Winnipeg lab for Ebola testing, something she hopes will change in the future with the new lab services being introduced.

“If we can bring new tests in, we'll be able to accomplish much more of that testing in the province for ourselves.”

Until then, she said, Alberta will remain dependent on public transport to ship blood tests of this nature out of province."


I predict it won't be long before it's impossible to obtain a diagnosis of not just Ebola, but several other diseases.


Artie.
 

Ice Guy

Inactive
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John Green

Veteran Member
I have been wondering all week if the airlines have been pressuring the administration on this Ebola situation. It just seems like travel restrictions are a no brainer at this point and there might be some other reason for not doing this. Like $$
 

LilRose8

Veteran Member
I fly to Orlando tomorrow and back next Saturday.....I will report how many empty seats there are.

there won't be any empty seats necessarily, since they bump and juggle and consolidate flights to avoid flying a half empty one. But, there may be LESS flights.
 

LilRose8

Veteran Member
One thing I have noticed lately are all the travel ads on TV for African safaris and cheap flights to anywhere. What are they thinking? Can you imagine taking your little daughter to Africa on a safari in the middle of this? Even if you are traveling to a country with no ebola, the flights cannot be guaranteed to be safe. I think it is in bad taste at the minimum and also downright irresponsible.
 

Jeff B.

Don’t let the Piss Ants get you down…
I flew up to Seattle on AA on Monday and returned Thursday morning (to DFW), both flights were packed...

Both airports were packed.

So, as of Thursday, no slow down.

Jeff B.
 

littledeb

Veteran Member
Why do we need the president to shut down the flights coming in n out of the African countries that have elbola? Why can't the airlines do it for the safety of their employees and passengers? I know it's probably the money but wouldn't you think that if 1 passenger gets sick because the airline didn't take care, that the passenger would sue the airline for unsafe conditions?
 

vessie

Has No Life - Lives on TB
We're assuming an incubation period of 2-21 days, and at this juncture, I'm unsure it's safe to do that. It has only been 23 days since Mr.Duncan flew....

Not to alarm anyone, but it wouldn't hurt if we opted to exercise "an abundance of caution" ourselves, now would it?

Artie.

And that is Exactly why my husband just cancelled our trip this week to Nashville, Tn. to see his mom.

Being the music captol of the world and all and the huge immigrant pop they're amassing, and the fact that he's now hearing in too many news sources that the CDC or whoever, is changing the incubation time from 21 back to the old standard 42 days, he want's to error on the side of caution and his mom was in full agreement with that. Yippeee! V
 

Tennessee gal

Veteran Member
I spoke recently with someone in the airline industry and one of their biggest concerns is the lack of detail cleaning of the planes in between flights.
 

Tucson Sal

Veteran Member
TSA Agent in Cleveland who patted down the nurse is self monitoring now.
http://www.19actionnews.com


TSA agent at Hopkins Airport patted down Ebola patient Amber Vinson

Posted: Oct 18, 2014 2:30 PM


Updated: Oct 18, 2014 2:47 PM

By Scott Taylor
Connect
Posted by 19 Action News Digital Team
Connect

Ebola patient Amber Vinson is an Akron native. (Source: Akron Public Schools)
Ebola patient Amber Vinson is an Akron native. (Source: Akron Public Schools)

CLEVELAND, OH (WOIO) - The TSA does confirm a routine pat-down by one of its agents on Amber Vinson at Hopkins Airport on Oct. 13, the day she traveled back to Dallas from Cleveland.
Dallas nurse and Akron native, Amber Vinson, was diagnosed with Ebola after returning from a visit in northeast Ohio. Vinson was one of several healthcare workers who treated Thomas Eric Duncan in Dallas, the first person diagnosed with Ebola in the U.S. The Liberian man died of Ebola on Oct. 8. Vinson traveled to Akron via Hopkins Airport on Oct. 10. She left on Oct. 13.

MORE
Ebola cases in the US

As health workers in Africa struggle to control the Ebola virus, two Dallas nurses who treated a man who died in October of Ebola have now contracted the disease.
More >>

A source is telling Scott Taylor that TSA agent involved in the pat-down is now on paid leave.

The TSA says:

"Out of an abundance of caution, a Cleveland Hopkins International Airport (CLE) Transportation Security Administration (TSA) Officer who conducted a routine pat-down of a traveler later reported to be infected with Ebola consulted with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). The employee is not reporting any symptoms. The employee was instructed by CDC to self-monitor over the next few days, as a precautionary measure. TSA also has assigned its chief medical officer to our employee to provide additional support.

No Cleveland TSA officer came in direct contact with the infected traveler, as all pat-downs are completed while employees are wearing disposable medical gloves."

Copyright 2014 WOIO. All rights reserved.
Updated: Oct 18, 2014 2:47 PM
By Scott Taylor
Connect

Posted by 19 Action News Digital Team


Copyright 2014 WOIO. All rights reserved.
 

Ice Guy

Inactive
Flew to Orlando today, every seat full. No one talking about Ebola and no one taking any precautions, pretty much SOP
 

NamasteMama

Senior Member
I canceled my flight tomorrow and I'm making a 16 hour round trip, there's not a snowballs chance in hell that I'm getting on a plane!
 

The Traveler

Veteran Member
I spoke to a couple of flight attendants flying out of DFW today while on the plane. Our flight was delayed and then they were both screwed on their return flight and were complaining about losing out on a flight home. I said well it could be worse, with the Ebola crap going on. They looked at me and said, we will be glad when that is not an issue anymore. They are aware and that is a good thing.
 
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